[Lincolnparkdc] Proposed signal to stop sign conversion at 11th and Constitution

Mon Mar 27 22:31:45 EDT 2023

There have been a lot of questions about WHY this light may be removed.  Just a guess, and reading between the lines a little, this sentence in the NOI may give a clue: “Based on a review of volume and crash data for the study intersection, it has been found that neither traffic signal nor HAWK signal warrants are met under the 2022 volume conditions.” (Emphasis added.)  In other words, there is no longer enough traffic volume to justify a stop light signal.

I don’t know if the traffic volume has gone down (doubtful) or if the volume required for a signal has gone up (possible) or if the volume measurements are wrong (maybe).  It might be interesting to hear from DDOT which it is, and what level of traffic is required to justify a signal.  We can speculate on various online studies and opinions of whether signals or signs are better, but DDOT apparently has a rule or regulation on how much traffic is needed for a signal.  It might be helpful to know the number of cars that DDOT requires, and what they have measured.

Trying to challenge DDOT’s traffic manual, which is probably pretty well researched, could be an uphill battle, no matter how many studies and articles we can find online.  They are traffic engineers and experts (whether you want to believe it or not), and a few articles are not going to change their rules.  We would be playing on their home field.  Still, it would be good to know what those rules are, and to make sure that they themselves are following them.

Instead, it might be more effective to show that there really IS enough traffic volume to justify a signal, or that there really ARE enough accidents or near-accidents to justify an exception.  A collection of personal experiences, maybe some video of close calls, and other site-specific facts might help to sway them.  Maybe take our own traffic counts (preferably on video, so it can be verified.)  And get a copy of their traffic manual; maybe start here<https://ddot.dc.gov/page/standards-and-guidelines>.

These are just some general suggestions on how to “fight city hall.”  Sorry, but I wasn’t offering to collect this data; I have enough problems with the traffic on my own corner.

--Peter--

From: lincolnparkdc <lincolnparkdc-bounces at lincolnparkdc.info> On Behalf Of James Grimaldi
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2023 9:45 PM
To: lincolnparkdc at lincolnparkdc.info
Subject: Re: [Lincolnparkdc] Proposed signal to stop sign conversion at 11th and Constitution

While interesting, none of the examples - not a single one — here fits the situation of this intersection which has had a stoplight for the 25 years I’ve lived here and I’ll bet it’s at least four decades.

On Mon, Mar 27, 2023 at 9:13 PM Stefanie Kendall <stefkendall at gmail.com<mailto:stefkendall at gmail.com>> wrote:
Hey all --

aforementioned article re: 4 way stops vs. lights, pros/cons of both:

https://www.groveport.org/DocumentCenter/View/3996/Intersection-Safety

On Mon, Mar 27, 2023 at 4:01 PM Stefanie Kendall <stefkendall at gmail.com<mailto:stefkendall at gmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks, Amber!

Here's nore from USDOT on the pluses and minuses of stop signs and traffic lights, set in the format of myth busting. Presents a pretty nice overview of both angles -- fodder for the critically engaged constituent.

TLDR:  Four-way stop signs should only be considered after an engineering study and a capacity analysis are performed.

On Sun, Mar 26, 2023 at 2:51 PM Amber Gove <amberanc6a at gmail.com<mailto:amberanc6a at gmail.com>> wrote:

(3rd time is a charm? I tried to forward my full 6A04 update but it was blocked—hopefully this time works).

Dear LP Neighbors,
Since a question came up on this listserv about the proposed signal to stop sign conversion at 11th and Constitution I’m sharing the update I sent around to my list yesterday which included the following:

Proposed traffic light to stop sign conversion, 11th and Constitution NE. DDOT has also sent us a Notice of Intent to convert the traffic signal at 11th and Constitution to a stop sign in order to improve safety. If it goes forward, traffic signals will be flashing red for 90 days while a safety evaluation is conducted. Please see additional details in the NOI here<https://ddotwiki.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/NI/pages/2194046977/NOI-23-49-TESD>. Comments are due by May 5th and we will be discussing this at our April 17 TPS meeting. Want to learn more? Here is blog<https://usa.streetsblog.org/2018/10/30/for-a-more-walkable-city-replace-signals-with-all-way-stops/> on the topic, as well as a study<https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9370016/> of similar signal-to-stop sign conversions in Philadelphia (TLDR: crashes were reduced by 24%).

The conversion is one of the solutions DDOT is proposing in response to resident requests for traffic calming on 11th. If it goes forward, signals would be flashing for 90 days while additional data are collected to help inform whether the change should be permanent or not.

I’ve asked DDOT to share more about why they are recommending this change at the April 24 6A TPS meeting. I’ve also asked them to share any speed and volume data collected and how this measure would reduce vehicle speed and improve safety, especially for people walking. You can find our ANC agendas and meeting/connection information here: ANC6A.org/agendas

In researching this type of measure I found this blog which includes an excerpt from Jeff Speck’s book Walkability City Rules. I’ll keep looking for more data and evidence and share what I find.

https://usa.streetsblog.org/2018/10/30/for-a-more-walkable-city-replace-signals-with-all-way-stops/

Thanks. If you’d like to receive my updates directly, please join via the link below.

Best,
Amber
---------------------------
Amber Gove
Chair, ANC6A
Commissioner, ANC6A04
email: AmberANC6A at gmail.com<mailto:AmberANC6A at gmail.com>
Twitter: @AmberGove

6A04 Updates: https://groups.google.com/g/anc-6a04-residents
6A Official Announcements: https://groups.google.com/g/anc-6a
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